Oh, yes.

[shadesong]

Emma Bull sums up the problem with the new Battlestar Galactica.

Go read that. Even if you don't care about BSG. (I don't. Never seen the show.) It's an excellent essay about being a female SF geek.

Comments

[crystalsage.livejournal.com]

Uh. Ok.

I practically live for Friday nights at 10 pm.
And I hate the fact that she thinks she speaks for all female sci fi geeks everywhere.

Bah, I say. Bah.

[wolflady26.livejournal.com]

I agree muchly with the bah. A girl who is outside of the box is an emasculated man. A girl who revels in her femininity is a vagina dentata. And a girl who doesn't dress particularly sexily or behave particularly masculinely is dismissed because she's a Cylon. Err, what? I guess they don't count. And the president, who mixes a soft femininity with a steel backbone doesn't count because... I dunno, I lost track. Oh, yeah, because she got the job because other people died. Of course, the male leads get their jobs because they earned it. Yeah, Adama was right on the fast track to becoming Admiral before everyone died. Oh, wait, no he wasn't. In fact, he wasn't even going to be captaining a ship anymore. And the fact that the president shows how much she deserves the position over and over again as the show goes on... hey, who needs facts that don't fit into a manifesto!

There's a difference between objecting to a fixed stereotype, and objecting to any role doesn't fit into a specific feminine ideal. When are people going to accept that freedom also means freedom to fill roles that aren't necessarily one person's idea of what a woman _should be_?

[crystalsage.livejournal.com]

All good points. To be honest, I wasn't even thinking that deeply. I have a hard time taking seriously a review of a show that's evolved and improved over 3 years, since she probably hasn't watched more than the miniseries. And I hate the fact that this essay suddenly made me feel GUILTY for enjoying the incredible storylines and sheer beauty and technical wonder of this show because she found the sexual stereotypes to be disturbing. Bah.

[redfishie.livejournal.com]

I felt really similiarly. I think the problem is to truly do a full review, you need to watch the full series...otherwise you risk being too black and white.

[crystalsage.livejournal.com]

Absolutely.

I was watching reruns of ST:TNG on spike a few weeks ago, and they happened to be showing the first few episodes of the series. OMG, I was shocked at how horrible it was. Now, its not like its the first time I've watched it, but in comparison to the later seasons, it was so bad...wooden acting, really bad dialogue, stupid plotlines. Its amazing that the show got off the ground that first season. Its so important to look past the glaring difficultiles of a show and look to what it could be. Anyone judging STTNG on its first season would be missing out on something fantastic.

[wolflady26.livejournal.com]

Grr. Yeah, me too. I also don't like it that she says she doesn't think it's realistic because she doesn't like the characters. I don't think there is anything unrealistic about any of the female leads.

[crystalsage.livejournal.com]

Especially in that context. I'm sorry, but a woman in a combat situation isn't necessarily going to be wearing high heels and wearing lace undies.

[wolflady26.livejournal.com]

Yes.

She would have a point if the women were all fantastically sexy, and also helpless little princesses waiting for a guy to save them. But helpless is about the last word you could use to define the female leads in BSG.

Even the bombshell that seems to have sparked the criticism is extremely intelligent and highly capable.

[catvalente.livejournal.com]

Yes, although to be fair, I had the same WTF moment about Six's first scene. There was no reason for her to go in and kiss that guy, rather than just, I don't know, chewing the fat for awhile while the world ended. The kiss was pure titillation for what the SFC thinks is its main demographic. The fact that Six's character developed doesn't change how lame that opening scene is.

Her next scenes are a 14 year old boy's fantasy because her job is to ensnare a 14 year old boy--Baltar.

[wolflady26.livejournal.com]

While the scene was certainly titillating, I'm not sure that it was it's only purpose. Throughout the series, there has been a kind of love/hate relationship toward the humans from the Cylons. They seem both fascinated and repelled by their progenitors, which is hinted at by that "are you alive?" line, and further developed throughout the series.

It is kind of cheesy, considering that Six has been merrily bopping Baltar for some time, but as we (think we) know, not all clones think and feel exactly alike.

And I mean, she's about to get blown up, making out is probably more fun than chit chat! :D

[catvalente.livejournal.com]

But why would the officer make out with her so readily? Jesus, can you say security risk? I equally don't understand why Helo readily kissed Six on Caprica. Why oh why are men so totally helpless in SF? Six isn't even that hot. I think she looks like a bug. Starbuck is far hotter--though I guess that makes me a freak, wanting to fuck the neutered male.

[wolflady26.livejournal.com]

Hmm, good question. Maybe it's the guys who should be complaining, not the girls!

A male perspective

[mastersantiago.livejournal.com]

Not exactly. *smile*

My impression was that the guy in that scene was pretty overwhelmed and wasn't exactly sure how to react. Which, I can say from personal experience, is pretty disarming. Ladies, I'll tell you all, no matter how self possessed a guy is, when confronted with an overwhelming amount of sexual tension with no warm up at all, we are very often going to go "deer in the headlights" on you! *smile*

Thank you for hitting on the whole concept of "are you alive?" but remember that there is a second part to that question as well; "How do you know?"

I think when you consider *both* of those questions the real purpose starts to show. Every single character, whether Cylon or Human, is engaged in answering those two questions. The only real difference is that the Cylons are aware of those questions while the humans aren't, though they are waking up to those questions as the series continues.

Re: A male perspective

[wolflady26.livejournal.com]

Hmmm, that's an excellent point indeed, especially paired with Sharon's response about why the Cylons hate the humans so much.

Re: A male perspective

[mastersantiago.livejournal.com]

Yes, that is certainly a very large part of it.

Also I believe that when you look at the relationship between Boomer and Six you see something else as well. While all the Cylons are working together on an over-all plan, I think that each model of Cylon is attempting to explore specific aspects of "the human condition."

Boomer and Six are opposite sides of the same coin. Both are exploring the issues of relationships, but Boomer is about Love while Six is about Sex.

This appears to be true of pretty much every Cylon we have met so far.

From the miniseries we met Doral and Leobon. Doral, the reporter, was basically about lies and misinformation. Leobon, the arms dealer, was about philosophy and how one percieves the truth.

From the rest of the series we met two more; the doctor from The Farm and another reporter, D'Anna Biers. Since we haven't seen enough of them to know what they are interested in specifically we can't really guess, but it won't surprise me to find that they do indeed have a particular interest in some area of human relationships.

If you remember that the war the Cylons are waging is as much psychological as it is physical then you start seeing many more possibilities in their actions.

Re: A male perspective

[wolflady26.livejournal.com]

Hmm, that could be an interesting point. Although Six and Boomer do both seem to be interested in one specific thing - procreation.

I am also interested in the friction between Six and Boomer that they showed us on Caprica.

(I also added you to my friends list - anyone who thinks this much about TV definitely seems like someone I should be reading! :D)

Re: A male perspective

[mastersantiago.livejournal.com]

Well, I'll go make sure to add you back, otherwise you won't be able to see many of my posts. And thank you for the compliment.

It's not that I think that much about TV exactly, but rather that I do enjoy a damn fine story, and BSG is definitely a damn fine story.

Most of my posts are more obsessed with my magic business, though I have a tendancy to get pretty philosphical about the art of entertainment so hopefully I'll be an interesting read for you. *smile*

Re: A male perspective

[wolflady26.livejournal.com]

It sounds interesting indeed, thanks for adding me back :)

Re: A male perspective

[mastersantiago.livejournal.com]

Yes, they both are interested in procreation, but I think that's the plan that *all* the Cylons are interested in. They want to be able to perpetuate their "species."

But as we know Sex has always been a dual function drive - pleasure and procreation.

It's also the one thing that the entire human race tends to be the most confused about. We all know how to do it and we all know how to enjoy it. It also seems to be the single thing that we tend to have the most hang-ups about.

So it only makes sense that the thing that the Cylons find most confusing about us is this aspect of our lives.

[jmfunnyface.livejournal.com]

I really look forward to Fridays at 10pm too! Usually I hate everything Sci Fi, but for some reason I love BSG. Although I do bitch for a solid hour before over the crapfest that is Stargate Atlantis because my boyfriend watches that too.

[crystalsage.livejournal.com]

Amen. I tried to get into Atlantis, I really did. It just doesn't do it for me. And certainly not on the same quality level as BSG.

[jmfunnyface.livejournal.com]

It's no where near BSG. The one character on Atlantis (the know-it-all guy) is just so damn annoying. He's the #1 reason why that show blows.

[kylakae.livejournal.com]

*cheers you mightily*

*looks down shirt*

Yep, still a woman, still a geek, still love that show!

[tinhuviel.livejournal.com]

I consider myself a SF geek and last time I checked in the mirror, I was female, but I don't agree with Emma. I think BSG is one of the best SF series to be made in many moons and it goes beyond gender in its storytelling. Any shortcomings of the females or treatment of females in the story arc are, I think, representative of the flaws in the Human Race portrayed in the show. But I'm pro-Cylon, so I may be stretching here.

[crystalsage.livejournal.com]

Any shortcomings of the females or treatment of females in the story arc are, I think, representative of the flaws in the Human Race portrayed in the show.


Amen...I think that's what I like about this show, is the messages that it sends. It makes us feel like we're looking in a mirror, saying "Look..this is who we are!"

[tinhuviel.livejournal.com]

And it ain't a pretty picture is it?

[crystalsage.livejournal.com]

We need to strap the members of the current administration down, pry open their eyes with toothpicks and make them watch it over and over again. "This is where you're bringing us."

[tinhuviel.livejournal.com]

Girlfriend, don't even get me started.

[crystalsage.livejournal.com]

HA! I love your icon. ;)

[tinhuviel.livejournal.com]

Thankies. I think it says everything I want to say without my having to go on another tirade that's sure to land me in Gitmo someday.

[amokk]

I thought it was a good article. I didn't always identify with male characters (gee, wonder why?), so I can somewhat understand.


As for the others, yes, those roles can be filled and done and all that and it's fine, but it's a bit questionable when it's the only roles visible in the series.

[mcsnee.livejournal.com]

A viewer with an agenda will always find agenda-supporting nits to pick in any TV series. Personally, I think BSG is great; I think the characters--male *and* female--are already well-rounded and are becoming more and more interesting as the series progresses; in short, it's pretty much the best thing on TV right now. And, despite that, I don't like the conservative-agenda bits and pieces that get thrown into the plots and dialogue. I could allow those to destroy my enjoyment of what is otherwise a fantastic work of pop-culture, or I can accept the fact that, y'know, nothing is perfect and move on.

Further, judging the entire series on the merits (or demerits) of the miniseries is pretty lame. Expecting complex, fully-formed characters to spring into existence immediately is foolish. It's almost always necessary to paint a character with broad strokes before refining the portrait and adding the interesting details and wrinkles that make a character a character and not a stereotype.

In short, I disagree pretty much completely with everything she's said here, except for the part about Edward James Olmos.

[heathrow.livejournal.com]

She is talking about problems with the miniseries. The show has grown and changed. I also hate anyone who talks for all X.

[gikiski.livejournal.com]

Yes. Excellent essay about being a female SF geek!

I just hope she brings herself around to continue watching the show instead of stopping at the mini-series. And then writes about that too.

[alathaniel.livejournal.com]

If the miniseries is all that existed, I'd be inclined to agree with the author. To an extent. Mostly where the blond cylon was concerned, and even until the latest two or three episodes I'd be inclined to agree on that point.

Starbuck as basicly a guy with boobs? I admit, I was a fan of the original Starbuck, so I wasn't sure I'd like the change. But let's run with it. She's an ace pilot, in a predominantly male profession if the squadron makeup is any indication. At the very least, she'll have to act like the boys until they don't regard her as an outside intruder. Not hopping into bed with someone else on the ship, despite there being attractive options? Doing something like that falls under the heading of "Damned Stuipid Things to Do" when both parties are in a combat/hazardous duty assignment. And lo, it turns out she did in fact do something that stupid once already. And got burned by it. A one dimensional cutout? Hell no. She's just not the kind of charachter you can easily develop in four hours. (I'd say more, but that leads to some semi-major spoilers for those that haven't seen the TV series.)

Boomer? Hey, let's ignore everything positive and plausible that was done, in favor of the "oh by the way" tidbit at the very end which happens to advance the point. Probbably one of the best handled charachters in the miniseries, and not just because of plot significance. Boomer was rewritten to the point that her callsign is nothing more than a nod to the original - she's basicly an original characther in the remake, so it stands to reason she's a bit better developed out of the gates than Starbuck or Apollo.

President Rosalyn. "Only got the job because everyone above her got killed, and isn't qualified"? BS. Anyone at that level of government is a veteran politician and/or leader to some extent - otherwise they couldn't handle their job. Everyone in the miniseries is put through what amounts to hell, and Rosalyn is arguably put through the worst one possible. The fact she wasn't utterly catatonic speaks to her strength, even if it's not the obvious "gun on each hip, cigar between my teeth" kind.

[asim.livejournal.com]

I dropped a comment in Adam's journal.

Suffice to say, I agree with all the other comments -- nice core idea, poor example.

[drwex]

thanks for the link. had I known Emma had an LJ I would've friended it long ago. And, given that it's her, I was willing to read a spoilerful essay, which I had avoided when others linked to it.

[shadesong.livejournal.com]

Everyone has an LJ these days. :) Got any other favorite authors? I might be able to point you at theirs, should they have one...

And the essay's really only spoilerful for the first five minutes of the miniseries, I think, and my favorite parts of the essay are the parts that don't deal with BSG at all. :)